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Historic Washington Overland Routes Last Post 23 Feb 2008 09:03 AM by 66rover99. 23 Replies. | Sort: |
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Craig Miller
Posts:11803
 | | 15 Jul 2007 06:48 PM |
| After reading Brian's post about heading up to the Thompson and Fraser canyons this weekend, and having read a *little* about BC 4x4 trails in some guide books I had my curiosity of this region has been piqued. I started with a wikipedia lookup of Fraser Canyon, and from there found *many* historic routes from Eastern, WA up through Eastern BC. I know there are very few remnants left of these trails, but the Whipsaw Trail is one such remnant. Here is some interesting reading on the different routes and areas. Fraser Canyon - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraser_Canyon Dewdney Trail - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dewdney_Trail Okanogan Trail - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Okanagan_Trail (VERY interesting -- possibly a good backroad drivers route Jerry?) Whatcom Trail (and Skagit Trail on map) - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whatcom_Trail Excerpt from the Whatcom Trail entry... "The Whatcom Trail was an overland trail from the Puget Sound area of Washington Territory during the Fraser Canyon Gold Rush of 1858" Just poke around the wikipedia cross-references. There is some really interesting historical route information in here. Craig | | |
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Brian Rutherford
Advanced Member
Posts:667
| | 15 Jul 2007 09:12 PM |
| Posted By Craig Miller on 07/15/2007 6:48 PM After reading Brian's post about heading up to the Thompson and Fraser canyons this weekend, and having read a *little* about BC 4x4 trails in some guide books I had my curiosity of this region has been piqued. I started with a wikipedia lookup of Fraser Canyon, and from there found *many* historic routes from Eastern, WA up through Eastern BC. I have a couple of paperback books with some decent background info on the area. The book "Trans-Canada Highway: Vancouver to Kamloops Through Historic Fraser & Thompson River Canyons" (How's that for a detailed title?...) covers exactly what it says, and it has a lot of detailed historic info, and fun trivia, and old photos. It is somewhat dated, being published in 1986, but obviously the history hasn't changed. The second book is "The Junction Country, Boston Bar to Clinton" This is part of the the "Lower Mainlinad Backroads" series, this being Volume 3. This is a kilometer by kilometer guidle to several routes, roughly in the area north of Boston Bar, east of Lillooet, and west of Cache Creek/Ashcroft. It was published in 1986. The photos of the old GMC 4x4 pickups, with Alaskan campers, and of a 2 wheel drive Dodge camper van being winched out of mud with a Hi-Lift jack just add to the feel of the book. I should track down the other three volumes of this series sometime. I have several of the "Backroad Mapbook" series too. These are from Musio Ventures in New Westminster. These are the most detailed maps of BC I have found for traveling the backroads. About a third of these books are the maps themselves, while the other two thirds contain detailed written info on fishing, hiking trails, winter recreation, paddling routes, and wilderness camping. I am always surprised when I check the mileage to places in lower BC and find them to be no further from home as many places in Washington state. It just seems far away when it's in a foreign country. Now if I just had more time to head north... Brian | | | |
| Brian Rutherford
Advanced Member
Posts:667
| | 15 Jul 2007 09:18 PM |
| Clearly, I have not figured out how the "quote" feature of this board functions... Sometimes it puts what I respond with in quotes, and sometimes it doesn't... Brian | | | |
| Andy Berglund
Tacoma, WA
Veteran Member
Posts:3453
| | 15 Jul 2007 09:28 PM |
| if you put the thingie into "source" mode you can see the html code and where the quotes end and begin. it's a little awkward.
a | | | |
| Brian Rutherford
Advanced Member
Posts:667
| | 15 Jul 2007 09:34 PM |
| Posted By Andy Berglund on 07/15/2007 9:28 PM
if you put the thingie into "source" mode you can see the html code and where the quotes end and begin. it's a little awkward.
a Thanks. OK, I tried that, but since I don't know code, which of the symbols is the quote mark? Sorry to use the bandwidth on this stuff guys. Brian | | | |
| Craig Miller
Posts:11803
| | 15 Jul 2007 10:17 PM |
| Or for the layman... :)
After you quote somebody, use the down-arrow on your keyboard to insure you are on the last linel, then start typing.
I agree that it is a bit awkward. I've been getting a bit frustrated with all the idiosynchrosies w/ this forum software, but I have to upgrade the core platform to a new version before I can integrate the newer version of the forum software. Unfortunately, that would require updating *EVERY* module on the entire site which would take a substantial amount of time, and likely break several of the websites features. I'm waffling, as I decide what to do about it.
Craig
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| Craig Miller
Posts:11803
| | 15 Jul 2007 10:20 PM |
| Posted By Brian Rutherford on 07/15/2007 9:12 PM [/quote]Posted By Craig Miller on 07/15/2007 6:48 PM After reading Brian's post about heading up to the Thompson and Fraser canyons this weekend, and having read a *little* about BC 4x4 trails in some guide books I had my curiosity of this region has been piqued. I started with a wikipedia lookup of Fraser Canyon, and from there found *many* historic routes from Eastern, WA up through Eastern BC. [/quote] I have a couple of paperback books with some decent background info on the area. The book "Trans-Canada Highway: Vancouver to Kamloops Through Historic Fraser & Thompson River Canyons" (How's that for a detailed title?...) covers exactly what it says, and it has a lot of detailed historic info, and fun trivia, and old photos. It is somewhat dated, being published in 1986, but obviously the history hasn't changed. The second book is "The Junction Country, Boston Bar to Clinton" This is part of the the "Lower Mainlinad Backroads" series, this being Volume 3. This is a kilometer by kilometer guidle to several routes, roughly in the area north of Boston Bar, east of Lillooet, and west of Cache Creek/Ashcroft. It was published in 1986. The photos of the old GMC 4x4 pickups, with Alaskan campers, and of a 2 wheel drive Dodge camper van being winched out of mud with a Hi-Lift jack just add to the feel of the book. I should track down the other three volumes of this series sometime. I have several of the "Backroad Mapbook" series too. These are from Musio Ventures in New Westminster. These are the most detailed maps of BC I have found for traveling the backroads. About a third of these books are the maps themselves, while the other two thirds contain detailed written info on fishing, hiking trails, winter recreation, paddling routes, and wilderness camping. I am always surprised when I check the mileage to places in lower BC and find them to be no further from home as many places in Washington state. It just seems far away when it's in a foreign country. Now if I just had more time to head north... Brian
[/quote][/quote]
Thanks for the suggestions Brian. I have a few 4x4 trail books on the area too (See my blog). My *perfect* 4x4 trails are those that are long (greater than 45 miles), have historical significance, aren't over-run by yahoos, have scenic views, and are hard enough to be adventurous. So far, the Whipsaw is as good as it gets.
I'm sure that Dave (BC Roverlanders) knows *way* more than I do about the area though. Since all the trails are closed in NW Washington, most Washingtonians have completely ignored this part of the state. I'm looking at these routes from an exploration, photography, and family vacation standpoint now. Craig
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| Dave Blair
Basic Member
Posts:144
| | 15 Jul 2007 10:26 PM |
| It's interesting that you're exploring these heritage trails. It's worth noting that you drove one last fall...
Whipsaw Trail History
The Whipsaw trail as we know it didn't exist by that name up until recently. Instead, it was part of a network of trails used by the Hudson's Bay Company's fur brigade. We call this trail the Whipsaw, primarily because a portion of it follows close to the Whipsaw Creek, and the name, being catchy, has stuck.
The original brigade trail in BC ran from Ft. St. James, Ft. Alexandria (just north of Williams Lake), Kamloops, then on the west side of the Okanagan lakes and down to Okanogan, WA, where it eventually joined the Columbia River for a final destination of Ft. Vancouver, WA. This was the primary method of transit of furs up until the mid 19th century, and it also became a northward re-supply route for the fur traders around 1825 when it was determined that it was quicker to send supplies by sea than to haul then east-west across the entire continent. The use of this route stopped in 1846 with the signing of the Oregon boundary Treaty, establishing the 49th Parallel as the Canada/US Border. Fear of taxation, combined with indian warfare caused the government of the day to look for alternate routes to the sea.
The trail we know as Whipsaw was part of this alternate route which went from Kamloops southward along the south shore of Nicola Lake, then southward again through the Tulameen Valley. It then connected with the Hope Bridge Trail and meandered towards Ft. Hope. The Hope Trail, which joins up with this interior trail along what we now know as the the Whipsaw, was used for the first time in 1848, and while barely passable, was the only available route to the coast at the time.
At the same time as this route was being used for the fur trade, Royal Engineers started construction of the Cariboo Wagon Road through the Fraser Canyon. In 1863 the Fraser Canyon route was completed and the Hope Bridge Trail/Whipsaw Trail route into interior BC fell into disuse as a primary fur route.
But, in 1885 a major gold strike at Granite Creek (Coalmont) swelled the settlement to over 2000 people. By the turn of the century, this bonanza was long gone, but in the early 1900s the boom moved over to Coal. Coalmont, blakeburn and the surrounding hills were again mined for their coal. Most of this coal production ended in 1957, however, a new coal operation has started up again close to Lodestone Lake, at the northern end of the Whipsaw.
From the mid 1900s, the trail fell into total disuse and was not used recreationally until the 1970s, other than the occasional hunter or trapper. With the advent of 4x4s and off-roading, it has been cut through again and is now a regular destination for recreational off-roaders. About 10 years ago, the Tread Lightly campaigns began to impact the way people used the trail and much of the damage that the higher meadows received from early 4x4ers is now healing.
An interesting point along the trail is the infamous Falcon Hill, which got its name from a fellow, Skip Marsh, who in 1979 drove his 1966 Ford Falcon 2 Wheel drive up the hill. A tongue in cheek historical marker is attached to a tree about halfway up the hill. Many an off-roader has raised his/her eyebrows at the thought of a 2 wheel drive Falcon driving up this hill, as it has stumped many 4x4s and required hours of winching for some to get up the hill. Generally, though, any truck with good articulation can make it up in one or two tries.
http://www.hopebc.ca/h.history.html
http://groups.msn.com/GhostTownsofBC/history.msnw
http://gallery.hot4x4.ca/albums/Whipsaw-July-04/adm.jpg | | | |
| Craig Miller
Posts:11803
| | 15 Jul 2007 10:39 PM |
| Awesome post Dave. :) I did know that the Whipsaw was part of a trade route (see original post again) from the brief research I did for the LRM article on our Whipsaw run. Most of that research came from the 2 posts I received on the BC Roverlanders website and 30 minutes spent with google. I appreciate the post though. Trails are SOOO much more fun to run (and respect) when you understand the history, archeology, geology, biology, and geology of an area. Thanks for all the great info.
Which trail on the wikipedia list is the Whipsaw a part of? The Dewdney Trail?
Craig | | | |
| Dave Blair
Basic Member
Posts:144
| | 15 Jul 2007 10:53 PM |
| I think its the red dotted lines on the Okanagan Trail map, but there are also signs — some knocked down now, where the Whipsaw intersects with the Dewdney and Hope Brigade trails. I agree, having some history of the trails makes it a lot more fun. I was at a rest stop on the shore of Nicola Lake, close to Merritt and by chance read the sign, a typical BC historical sign. It was talking about the fur route from Ft. St. James down to Ft. Kamloops, but the info just sort of ran off the bottom of the sign. Then I noticed a tiny arrow that had peeled off the bottom, pointing to the other side. That had the rest of the route, including the dates of use of the Tulameen/Whipsaw. Next time I'm by there, I'm gonna take my camera and take a picture of the map...
Dave | | | |
| Craig Miller
Posts:11803
| | 15 Jul 2007 11:03 PM |
| I live on the Skagit River in Mount Vernon. I think I'm going to make a point out of researching the original trade routes. Starting with the Skagit and Whatcom Routes, working my way up to the Okanogan routes and the extension of all of them in BC. Create GPX files w/ historically interesting points and go take some photos in the field. There has to be some good info in my local library. I'd love to re-trace some of these original routes and see what's left of them. Craig | | | |
| Brian Rutherford
Advanced Member
Posts:667
| | 16 Jul 2007 07:17 AM |
| Posted By Craig Miller on 07/15/2007 10:39 PM Trails are SOOO much more fun to run (and respect) when you understand the history, archeology, geology, biology, and geology of an area. Agreed!! Much of what got me into the whole 4x4 thing was looking for photo locations and also researching history related to railroads. But in time, my history interest has spead to anything related to transportation and the westward migration of North America. I spend a fair amount of time on Stevens Pass taking railroad photos, and as a little side project I have been trying to locate all the old pieces of the old Cascade Highway that remain. Brian Rutherford | | | |
| Brian Rutherford
Advanced Member
Posts:667
| | 16 Jul 2007 07:24 AM |
| Posted By Craig Miller on 07/15/2007 11:03 PM I live on the Skagit River in Mount Vernon. I think I'm going to make a point out of researching the original trade routes. Starting with the Skagit and Whatcom Routes, working my way up to the Okanogan routes and the extension of all of them in BC. Create GPX files w/ historically interesting points and go take some photos in the field. There has to be some good info in my local library. I'd love to re-trace some of these original routes and see what's left of them. Craig
That sounds like great fun to me too. And a great excuse to go hit the backroads and trails as well. Old maps with early routes and early roads on them are very interesting to me. But then, I like maps in general, as the drawers stuffed full in my office would show...
Brian Rutherford | | | |
| Craig Miller
Posts:11803
| | 16 Jul 2007 06:17 PM |
| LOL... I understand Brian. I'm a geographer, and for years I collected old maps. I got rid of them all when I moved to Maine (what a mistake). Now I'm getting interested in the historic Overland Routes of Washington. Stage, mines, or foot/horse.
I went to the library today with my son and did some research on the Whatcom Trail. There wasn't much to be found. I found some old maps with it on there, but I really need to track down the original surveryors notes if I have any prayer of figuring out where the trail actually went. The maps were at a scale of 1:500,000 or smaller.
I also found some write-ups about it. It turns out that it was only a partial trail and never really used. It was promoted heavily by the city of Whatcom at the time. All sorts of miners (comparable to the numbers that went from the East Coast to San Francisco during the gold rush) flocked to the area. It was going to be *the* route up to the gold mines in Canada. They weren't able to punch the road all the way through the mountains though, and eventually people stopped waiting around the town and headed back to San Francisco. Bellinghams first boom and bust.
Craig
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| Craig Miller
Posts:11803
| | 16 Jul 2007 06:19 PM |
| Brian,
How much of the old highway have you found? I stopped and read the roadside feature on the westbound lanes on the East side of the pass last summer. It couldn't help but wonder if there is enough left of the route to re-construct it as a 4x4 trail before it is lost for good.
Craig
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| Brian Rutherford
Advanced Member
Posts:667
| | 16 Jul 2007 09:41 PM |
| Posted By Craig Miller on 07/16/2007 6:17 PM
LOL... I understand Brian. I'm a geographer, and for years I collected old maps. I got rid of them all when I moved to Maine (what a mistake). Now I'm getting interested in the historic Overland Routes of Washington. Stage, mines, or foot/horse.
I went to the library today with my son and did some research on the Whatcom Trail. There wasn't much to be found. I found some old maps with it on there, but I really need to track down the original surveryors notes if I have any prayer of figuring out where the trail actually went. The maps were at a scale of 1:500,000 or smaller.
I also found some write-ups about it. It turns out that it was only a partial trail and never really used. It was promoted heavily by the city of Whatcom at the time. All sorts of miners (comparable to the numbers that went from the East Coast to San Francisco during the gold rush) flocked to the area. It was going to be *the* route up to the gold mines in Canada. They weren't able to punch the road all the way through the mountains though, and eventually people stopped waiting around the town and headed back to San Francisco. Bellinghams first boom and bust.
Craig Have you visited the Whatcom Museum in Bellingham? The photo archives alone can kill, uh, occupy, many hours... Lots of stuff to see and research there. I try not to visit too often as it costs me when the bill comes for the old photo reprints... Brian | | | |
| Brian Rutherford
Advanced Member
Posts:667
| | 16 Jul 2007 10:06 PM |
| Posted By Craig Miller on 07/16/2007 6:19 PM
Brian,
How much of the old highway have you found? I stopped and read the roadside feature on the westbound lanes on the East side of the pass last summer. It couldn't help but wonder if there is enough left of the route to re-construct it as a 4x4 trail before it is lost for good.
Craig Some of the old roads I have found, I can't be sure of yet if they are part of the old highway. I need better (more!) maps. I stumbled on a map/photo of a piece of the old highway that I didn't know was still there just a few days ago. I haven't been there to see it in person yet, as I found it online. I was looking at a map/aerial website and saw a road labeled Old Cascade Highway, west of Miller River (west of Skykomish) and southwest of Money Creek campground. (I just looked at local.live.com. I thought the site I was looking at a few days ago was in color, and the photo for this area is in B&W...) This road peters out along the south side of the Skykomish River with no clear indication of where it might have joined up again with other sections of the old highway. Another section I think was the old highway is west of Merritt. If you find where White Pines Road leaves Highway 2, then follow Highway 2 west, skipping the first road that heads south of the highway, but following the second south road. This road drops off Highway 2, then parallels it west for a ways, before dropping down to the RR tracks. The grading on this section is much heavier than would be done for a simple forest service road, and it's location right next to the current highway makes me think it is the old road. The road also continues in both directions beyond what is shown on the maps. Brian | | | |
| Craig Miller
Posts:11803
| | 16 Jul 2007 10:15 PM |
| Hmmm..... I need to get a wiki going so we can start assembling all these tidbits different people keep picking up. All the tidbits together over time and it eventually starts to sort itself out into something interesting.
Craig
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| Todd Eliason
Veteran Member
Posts:3520
| | 16 Jul 2007 10:27 PM |
| Posted By Craig Miller on 07/16/2007 10:15 PM
Hmmm..... I need to get a wiki going so we can start assembling all these tidbits different people keep picking up. All the tidbits together over time and it eventually starts to sort itself out into something interesting.
Craig
Yeah Craig, You don't have much on your plate... Why don't you get on that! :)
Seriously, you have done a great job on this site and it is much appreciated. A Wiki would be great but for now maybe we can deposit the info in a thread for a while... | | | |
| Craig Miller
Posts:11803
| | 17 Jul 2007 10:29 AM |
| Thanks Todd, I appreciate the compliment.
I believe a wiki would ultimately simplify the website by consolidating multiple modules (tech articles, blogs, map repository, etc). This in turn would make my life easier (I hope).
Craig
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